follow up does the appetite effect feel different or just stronger
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#tirzepatide 2024-07-22
Monday42 messages12 participantstimes are UTC
Highlights from this day
- apnoea_down_two — he was at 52. thats why he read it twice 20:23
- dublin_dose — the two summary pages side by side, personal identifiers cropped out 20:45
- week_zero — thats the most concrete thing ive seen in here 21:02
- VialBot — archive lookup: `AHI` mentioned in 41 lines, 9 of them with attached sleep study data. #tirzepatide #wins #bloodwork 21:19
- peak_split — and that is a completely legitimate endpoint that no trial measures well 21:23
the sweet spot argument is really about effect per side effect, not a magic number, anyway
the GI difference held for me right up to 15, which isnt what a couple of people here found, ymmv
slightly off topic but did going from 7.5 semaglutide to 5 of this feel like a step down for anyone
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restarted at 2.5 after 19 months off and the first two doses reminded me why titration exists
the sweet spot thing is survivorship, the people it worked for stayed and said so
changed my mind about needing 15, i was chasing a number rather than an outcome
held 10 for 22 months and lost 3kg over that stretch, slow and boring and fine
the trials titrated every four weeks to a target, most people here stop at whatever works
SURMOUNT is weight
5 did nothing
i went to 15 and came back to 10, more suppression wasnt more useful for me, for what its worth
SURMOUNT-OSA was the sleep apnoea trial and it is not a weight headline however its quoted
checked the units twice
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5 was where i first noticed it properly, 2.5 did almost nothing for me, thats just me
does switching from semaglutide need a gap or do you just start
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the apnoea trial is the one that convinced my brother and he does not care about weight at all
primary endpoint was apnoea hypopnoea index, not weight. it dropped a long way in both trials
order of 25 to 30 fewer events an hour on treatment
is that a lot
if you were sitting at 40 events an hour then yes, that is the difference between severe and mild
he was at 52. thats why he read it twice
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worth saying the trials ran for a year and were not powered for cardiovascular outcomes
AHI is a surrogate. a very meaningful one to anyone who has slept next to someone with severe apnoea, but a surrogate
right. AHI improving is not the same as proving fewer heart attacks later
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my own AHI went 31 to 9 over about ten months on tirz. i have the two sleep studies
the two summary pages side by side, personal identifiers cropped out
ahi-before-after.png
1 image · 240 KB · not retained in the public archive
thats the most concrete thing ive seen in here
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post it in #wins as well, that channel is thin on non scale outcomes
will do later, on a train
did you come off the machine
no. sleep clinic wanted another study at 18 months first and i agreed with them
sensible. AHI is noisy night to night, one study is a snapshot
how noisy
enough that a single bad night can move you a severity band. thats why they repeat them
archive lookup: AHI mentioned in 41 lines, 9 of them with attached sleep study data. #tirzepatide #wins #bloodwork
nine sets of real data is more than i expected honestly
its been slowly accumulating since about mid 2024
hair_month_fourAHI is a surrogate. a very meaningful one to anyone who has slept next to someone with…
on the surrogate point — agreed, but the reason i chased it wasnt heart attacks, it was being awake in the afternoon
and that is a completely legitimate endpoint that no trial measures well
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noted. thanks all